fcp.co logo transparent
fcp clapperboard
Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me
14 Nov 2020
Moving over to a new system, we couldn't take the old avatars - so please upload a new one!
  • Page:
  • 1

TOPIC: Have I got this right? External v Library Storage.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 15 Apr 2016 13:46 #75418

  • enonod
  • enonod's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 15
  • Thank you received: 0
Macbook Pro (SSD) + External drives (usb 3) + external 250GB T1 (SSD) FCPX 10.2x... Newbie

Before researching I took all my AVCHD card backups and loaded them into Libraries one card per library and stored the media in the libraries. More will follow. I then started tagging many of the more interesting clips.
I then did some 'late' reading and wondered if I did the right thing.
My analysis of this confusing subject after watching many tutorials follows and I would be obliged if somebody could suggest whether I have done right or should change before going further.

I am a single worker and intend making home videos from very varied footage.
It is likely that many of the clips or part clips will appear in multiple videos or versions of videos.
I believe in using tags to find clips. Original cards and master libraries are backed up twice.

Are these conclusions correct please...
1. That subject/object tagging of clips cannot be done in fcpx with external media (by now .mov)
2. Copying from one library (my masters) to another will copy media as media not links, because they were not externally stored.
3. For speed I am better working with each final project using media stored in the library containing the project, by copying from one to another.
4. Because of (2 & 3) I would be copying media not links into the project library and thus it does not matter whether the media was stored externally or not since the media would be copied to the project library from either possible source.
5. Importing cannot be done with clips from a library
5. If (1) is correct then I am better off for what I want to do, storing master clips as I have rather than externally.
Thank you.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 15 Apr 2016 19:53 #75434

  • Tom Wolsky
  • Tom Wolsky's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 4616
  • Karma: 112
  • Thank you received: 748
Most of this is wrong. You should not import each card into a separate library.

A library is a production. The whole production should be organized through a primary library.

1. If I understand this is wrong. Tagging is done to clips in FCP. It doesn't matter if the media is internal or external.

2. That's correct. That's why you don't use separate libraries.

3. The media needs to be organized through the clips in a central library. The clips are linked to the media, whether the media is external or internal.

4. Yes, but you shouldn't have multiple libraries to start with.

5. I do not know what this means.

6. Not the way you're organized and imported the media.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 15 Apr 2016 20:30 #75436

  • BenB
  • BenB's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User is blocked
  • User is blocked
  • Posts: 10102
  • Karma: -34
  • Thank you received: 1277
Watch the "Media Management Basics" on this web page.
finalcutprox.guru/tutorials/page12/level1finalcutprox/

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 08:11 #75450

  • enonod
  • enonod's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 15
  • Thank you received: 0
Thank you BenB, I have seen this material and although I may have missed something it did not guide me to a solution, unless my whole requirement is wrong in the first place.

Thank you for your response Tom.
I am having difficulty understanding how best to store the media and find it, from what you have said.
Are you saying I should import the cards into a single Library for the below purpose?
Vitally, have I missed some way of viewing external media and tagging it in FCPX ???

My original (obviously wrong) concept was that by importing my cards into Library(ies) I could then view them and tag them at leisure in FCPX. i.e. many cards will contain birds and I will wish later to find birds (or types of birds) while doing a as yet unknown project. (waves, rainbows, dinosaurs etc.)
I do this with thousands of photographs in DAM software.
When starting a new project (in a new library) I could open these Libraries and search for rainbows, view them and select which ones I require and copy them to the project library.

I could/can see no way of doing that with external media in folders because the clips are invisible unless actually Importing (which is too late). I would have to view each card archive at import and view the clips for what I want, each time.
I cannot see how I can tag clips that have been imported to external storage folders except in Finder which will not permit my original concept. Tagging can be done but only in general terms not clip content which is mixed.

You have said that tagging is done in FCPX (as I have agreed above) but if it is only able to be done when bringing in clips for a specific project then it is too late (how did I find those correct clips in the first place?), and surely tagging after they are found (and used) has no further point?

I would be grateful for any suggestion that will allow me to achieve my basic concept for finding the clips I will need for a specific project at any time, as described but in the proper way.
I do not take video for the purpose of a specific project as a documentary maker might, I am wanting to use video taken with no concept in mind at the time it is taken. So my video is general stock material.

How would you set yourself up to achieve this please, if you have time to explain?

Addendum: (5) was really asking for confirmation that Import cannot be done from a Library to a Library.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 12:39 #75454

  • BenB
  • BenB's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User is blocked
  • User is blocked
  • Posts: 10102
  • Karma: -34
  • Thank you received: 1277
"I could/can see no way of doing that with external media in folders because the clips are invisible unless actually Importing..."

You do import them, but check the "Leave In Place" option. They stay in the external folder, and you till have access to them inside your FCPX Library.

I see what you're doing. Make a Library, call it "Stock Media" or something like that. Create Events for different types of media, then keyword each to put them in collections for further organization. You can even put multiple keyword collections into a Folder to keep them together.

You can have multiple Libraries open and use material between them. FCPX uses UNIX soft and hard links, so that when you copy something from one Library to another, it isn't physically duplicated, you don't eat up drive space.

Now, what I do for photos, I have them in Apple Photos (which is lame, I sure miss Aperture) and can access them via the Photos browser (lower right). I have a Folder called Stock Photos, and albums inside of that to organize them by like groups. But no reason you couldn't use a FCPX Library to do this instead.

So make a Library, organize your stock photos and whatever in it. Then use that to find stuff for every new Library (production) that you work with. Again, you can have multiple Libraries open at once. You have a Project timeline open that you're editing into. You need a sock photo. Go to the Stock Media library you made, find it, drop it into that timeline.

Not sure if this helps or not.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 13:48 #75455

  • Tom Wolsky
  • Tom Wolsky's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 4616
  • Karma: 112
  • Thank you received: 748
Just to add to what Ben already told you. With this amount of material I would definitely not import into the library, leave the material external. No, you can't import from library to library.

You can import the media into FCP assigning a specific folder to store your media, leaving it external to FCP library.

For material that doesn't get import directly from cards, you can also do a great deal of organization using folders and Finder tags. This tagging and folder structure can be replicated directly in FCP using the folder and tags options in the import window. You can of course further refine your organization within the library.

If you import images using the Media Browser in FCP, the stills will be copied from the Photos library to the designated library location.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 14:47 #75457

  • BenB
  • BenB's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User is blocked
  • User is blocked
  • Posts: 10102
  • Karma: -34
  • Thank you received: 1277
Just to add to what Tom already told you. You can import and Leave In Place to Library A. Then import and Leave In Place to Library B. The original being in same for both. Yes, as long as you do a Leave In Place, multiple Libraries can access the same media files. FCPX doesn't ever alter that original file on the drive, just the DATA inside the library (metadata, filters, effects, edits).

Did I just make this too confusing?

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 18:17 #75458

  • enonod
  • enonod's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 15
  • Thank you received: 0
Thank you both for your time. Nobody is confusing me.
Have I got this right?

From what I can deduce my mistakes were importing each card into separate 'stock' libraries and as media, to boot.

I see what you're doing. Make a Library, call it "Stock Media" or something like that. Create Events for different types of media, then keyword each to put them in collections for further organization. You can even put multiple keyword collections into a Folder to keep them together.

That is precisely what I was doing, but the 'link' method means less media stored and moved.

I should have imported the media from card and stored it externally and then imported a second time from external to my 'stock' library', leaving in place, (which will then be only links) and there I can start key-wording my 'stock'. I had not appreciated a second import to achieve a links style 'stock' library instead of media.

When working on a project I create the project library, open the 'stock' library and start finding the required clips in the same way as I was originally (except that there is now no live media) which I then copy to the project library, which will also end up as links.

This can be repeated using the same external media and the same clips can be reused, always as links.

If the above is now correct, (and it does appear to work) then please indulge me with a couple of questions...
1. Is there any slow down due to not having the media in the 'stock' library?
2. I save my AVCHD cards by copying the complete structure to disk. It is also possible to create an archive in FCPX. As far as I can tell there is no difference as long as the full structure is saved. Is that correct or is there some other advantage in using archives?

If all is well above, then I thank you both for your time and for setting me straight.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 18:58 #75459

  • Tom Wolsky
  • Tom Wolsky's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Moderator
  • Moderator
  • Posts: 4616
  • Karma: 112
  • Thank you received: 748
1. No.

2. Yes.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 16 Apr 2016 19:19 #75460

  • enonod
  • enonod's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 15
  • Thank you received: 0
I just took one of my original 'stock' libraries with media, set an external Storage location with Modify Settings then Consolidated (out) to a place on the same USB 3 drive and within 3 seconds 32GB was placed in external folder and library package showed as converted to links, all tags still in place.
I cannot thank you both, enough.

There is no need for a reply.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 17 Apr 2016 04:13 #75466

  • BenB
  • BenB's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User is blocked
  • User is blocked
  • Posts: 10102
  • Karma: -34
  • Thank you received: 1277
Tell me there's no need, and I'll find a need. LOL!!!!!!

Glad it's making more sense to you.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 17 Apr 2016 09:14 #75472

  • MsJustine
  • MsJustine's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Banned
  • Banned
  • I am in Durban, safe and warm...
  • Posts: 971
  • Karma: -76
  • Thank you received: 46
1. That subject/object tagging of clips cannot be done in fcpx with external media (by now .mov)
Tagging can be done in the Mac OS finder-Another option would be to keyword the ranges you need.
From what I have read you will have a lot of media and you will need to sort the usable media from the "junk" really unsuitable, this is a very important 1 step in editing in FCPX, it reduces the amount of video data you see, it does not actually delete it, if you set ranges around the rubbish unwanted footage, then press the delete key, the range is "tagged" as rejected, a red strip appears at the top of the thumbnail, and if you set the view menu to hide rejected you have a better chance of finding material you need.

Do the same for great footage, pressing the F key, "tags" that range with a green stripe, if you then set the browser to show only favorites, your clips will only be the favorites.

2. Copying from one library (my masters) to another will copy media as media not links, because they were not externally stored.

Copying makes a clone or a symlink to the original file location, moving is what it says on the tin, re-writes the file location to the new location. With moving, you have 1 location with the data, and 1 with a virtual file, that is the symlink files, which are tiny files that tell the database where to find the actual file.

3. For speed I am better working with each final project using media stored in the library containing the project, by copying from one to another.

No, it does not matter, it would be best to not use the internal drive, for obvious reasons! Setting a location as external, as on a raid or attached drive just means that if you are working on a project and that drive is lost/detached, then you loose access to the data, if you need to work on the project, then setting the library up so that the original files are external and your proxies are internal is a great way to work on the road.

If you move folders, it is best to do it through FCPX than outside.

4. Because of (2 & 3) I would be copying media not links into the project library and thus it does not matter whether the media was stored externally or not since the media would be copied to the project library from either possible source.

5. Importing cannot be done with clips from a library
Once you have a library, it has to contain footage/clips, so you cannot re-import the same footage unless you delete it first. I think you mean import from 1 library to another library, if you are working on 1 project-1 library even this is not important, If you are using the same footage for more than 1 project, then 1 library many projects would be better.

5. If (1) is correct then I am better off for what I want to do, storing master clips as I have rather than externally. Bad idea to store original files on the laptop, spill water, drop the laptop, power surge, then :blush:

Again I assume not on an internal hard drive, it is best to not use the internal hard drive for project work, unless you are working on a laptop with tiny hard drives, the laptop hard drive is best used for proxy editing, proxy files are 1/4 resolution, and take up less space than full resolution files, clicking from original media to proxy is easy, just don't forget to do this step, if you share with proxy files selected, you will share with 1/4 resolution files. Change back to original media before sharing/exporting.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 17 Apr 2016 17:57 #75507

  • enonod
  • enonod's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 15
  • Thank you received: 0
Thank you for your time and input MsJustine, but I think I am OK now.
I never use the internal drive for manipulating data, I think there may be some confusion, when I refer to external or not I do not mean external drive or not; I mean external to the library and libraries are never stored on the internal drive even though it is SSD. For speed I use an external SSD.
I import to a library on a usb drive, store the data external to the library on a usb drive which leaves my library as links which I then keyword.

In the latest instance I had already keyworded (tags) libraries containing live media...

I just took one of my original 'stock' libraries with media, set an external Storage location with Modify Settings then Consolidated (out) to a place on the same USB 3 drive and within 3 seconds 32GB was placed in external folder and library package showed as converted to links, all tags [keywords] still in place.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Have I got this right? External v Library Storage. 20 Jul 2016 18:33 #78765

  • SKiD
  • SKiD's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Fresh Boarder
  • Posts: 3
  • Thank you received: 0
Hi guys,
is there any way to delete external files? At some projects I get lots of footage which is garbage and I want to get rid of it ASAP. But this is possible only when files are inside library.
I understand this "feature" is here s I cannot delete files linked in other libraries, but is there any way to get around?
Thank you.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

  • Page:
  • 1