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TOPIC: Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes?

Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 25 Oct 2019 12:58 #102253

  • VJIse
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Hi,
I have a support ticket with Red Giant for this issue. But I thought I'd check here to see if anyone here was using Pluraleyes?

We are trying to sync up Video with scratch sound recorded on an Atomos Shogun 7 in proRes 422 @ 1080 25p. The 2nd source audio is recorded in .wav on a Zoom F8 audio recorder on 2 independent tracks.
Everything works well inside Pluraleyes, the sync works. I export an FCPX XML from Pluraleyes with the option to create an event with replaced audio. When I import this to FCP X with either clips left in place or importing the media. The audio lanes for the synced audio are there but they are empty. So we have no audio in the event.

As an experiment, I saved out a Premiere XML from Pluraleyes and brought that into Resolve 16.1, the audio linked and was in sync. I then saved an FCPX XML from Resolve, brought that into FCP X. It came in as a project. It had all the 2nd source audio in the correct place, but it hadn't made sync clips. I then tried the FCP X XML from Pluaraleyes in Resolve and that gave an error. And listed the FCP X XML versions that Resolve supported which were from 1.3 to 1.8. So I opened that XML in TextEdit and Pluraleyes is saving out a version 1.2 FCP X XML.

So on to my main question has anyone managed to get an XML from Pluraleyes to FCPX and have all the synced audio brought in? If you have what version of FCP X did you use? and what was the version of Pluraleyes?

Thanks

Ian

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Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 25 Oct 2019 13:15 #102254

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VJIse wrote: ...So on to my main question has anyone managed to get an XML from Pluraleyes to FCPX and have all the synced audio brought in? If you have what version of FCP X did you use? and what was the version of Pluraleyes?...


I have done this many times without problem from PluralEyes 3.5 up to the current version which is 4.1.8. I haven't tried it on FCPX 10.4.7 but I used it on many prior versions. Usually audio is a polyphonic .wav file from a Zoom F8 or Sound Devices MixPre-6. We always import with "leave files in place". Camera media is UHD 4k H264 29.97 or 23.98 fps 8-bit 4:2:0 from Sony Alpha, Panasonic DVX-200, GH5 and S1 and also ProRes 422 from the same cameras captured via Atomos Ninja V. I think the S1 does 10-bit 4:2:2 ProRes to the Ninja V and the Alpha cameras 8-bit 4:2:2.

However - I never use the option to replace audio, I always want all the audio sent to FCPX and I manipulate it myself. Maybe there is a bug there?

In general my doc team doesn't use PluralEyes much since we started using Tentacle devices for sync. Those are a much better, faster, more reliable workflow. However we still use PE occasionally for special situations. The sync algorithms are definitely better than FCPX.

In the worst case scenario where audio recorder date/time was not set properly and folder management did not group audio with corresponding video, PE is so fast it can search across hundreds or even thousands of files looking for a sync match based solely on waveform. When that happens I use it as a search tool to find the audio for a given video clip, then sync those files in FCPX.

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Last edit: by joema.

Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 25 Oct 2019 13:55 #102255

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Thanks joema, we do use Tentacle Sync. We want to give our students as much experience as we can. So we thought we'd teach them Tentacle sync, Sync'n Link and Pluraleyes. I'll try the option from Pluraleyes to export all the audio and not just the 2nd source.

Ian

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Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 10 Sep 2020 23:18 #109967

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Joema,

When you import the project inside FCPX without Replaced audio, how do you work with the synced timeline ?? Do you create a compound clip out of it ? But then you can't enable and disable audio tracks, can you ?

Subquestion: how do you manage audio roles ?

Help is welcome !

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Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 11 Sep 2020 11:42 #109974

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manoucho wrote: Joema,

When you import the project inside FCPX without Replaced audio, how do you work with the synced timeline ?? Do you create a compound clip out of it ? But then you can't enable and disable audio tracks, can you ?

Subquestion: how do you manage audio roles ?


Normally I don't use PluralEyes that much, now that we have Tentacle on most of our cameras. PluralEyes creates (1) A project with connected clips in sync and (2) A multicam. Both are imported to FCPX via XML.

In a sense it's similar to Tentacle Sync Studio which creates a project and multicam, but using LTC audio timecode data recorded on the left audio channel.

I never have it replace audio because I want access to all the original tracks. Once you have the multicam in FCPX, you typically would open the MC clip, verify the sync, if audio role assignment is needed, lasso all audio to select, right-click and assign. Then in the event browser skim the MC clip and mark favorites, rejects and keyword ranges, then filter or search that and insert the queried ranges into a timeline.

Unlike sync clips, multicam clips inherit changes, so even if you had already put MC clip ranges in a timeline you can later reassign audio roles on the parent clip and all MC clip ranges in the timeline will inherit that.

Although Tentacle Sync requires hardware and is more expensive, it works much more reliably, so my team generally uses that.

For simple cases such as a multicam interview, we often don't need Tentacle or PluralEyes because all cameras have good scratch audio, there are only a few takes and FCPX audio sync has no problem with it.

I mainly use PluralEyes as an audio search tool for very difficult cases. E.g, audio recorder had wrong time of day, media offload was disorganized and what audio clips go with what video clips is unknown. Or where where FCPX audio sync mostly works but has a problem with 1 or 2 clips. In that case I'll import the batch of clips in PluralEyes, if it syncs the clips then note the filenames and time offsets and then hand-adjust those in FCPX.

In the "chaotic offload/wrong time of day" case, you can import one A/V clip to PluralEyes channel, then import hundreds of audio clips to another channel, and it will search for a match. Obviously that is a contingency procedure.

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Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 12 Sep 2020 18:05 #109992

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Thanks a ton Joema

I did as you said, I used PE for reference and then synced all the 200 clips in FCPX. It was long but worked as a charm.

It's still disappointing that FCPX cannot batch sync the way PE does. A lot of small, cheap productions are shot that way.

I wish PE was investing serious energy into making it a great tool for FCPX. One can dream !

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Pluraleyes to FCP X any successes? 12 Sep 2020 19:24 #109996

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manoucho wrote: ...It's still disappointing that FCPX cannot batch sync the way PE does. A lot of small, cheap productions are shot that way...


FCPX can sync a whole batch of files if you first label all clips from each camera in the Inspector. I don't know what the limit is but if the scratch audio is halfway decent you can probably do 50 or 100 clips.

For jobs where my team doesn't use Tentacle, we just make sure the cameras and recorders have the correct time of day. We offload to named folders, usually /ProductionName/ShootingDay/CameraName+Operator. Then we import using FCPX preference Keywords From Folders. All clips are tagged with the camera+operator name, since sometimes multiple operators use the same camera model.

Then after ingest to FCPX we select the auto-generated keyword for all clips from a given camera, and in Inspector label all those with a camera+operator name. You can label 1,000 clips in one batch. Since we ensured the time of day clocks were correct, all clips will sort adjacent to each other in the Event Browser. For each interview it is easy to pick out visually the required clips, select, right-click and create multicam, sync on audio. That way we have a separate multicam clip for each interview.

It usually works fairly well. On large event shoots with several roaming gimbal operators and other shooters doing brief takes, it doesn't work well -- even using PluralEyes. The audio is too different from widely separated shooters.

If we discover after the shoot or partway through the shoot that a recorder or camera clock was not set correctly, we tell them don't change it but email us the variation, e.g, how many hours/min/sec it was fast or slow from the "wall clock" time. Then in post it's easy to select all clips from that device and batch update the date/time with Modify>Adjust Content Created Date and Time.

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Last edit: by joema.
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